quote:

Originally posted by mx510:
I am with Parker on this one. I think that there is no reason why a 250 2-stroke should not be able to ride in the "lites" class. If for nothing else it helps to try to keep the sport somewhat on the cheaper side for people trying to get in and for purists that still love and race 250 2-strokes. I do think that the 250 2-stroke is still competitive with 450s but is better suited to match up against 250fs. After all mx is 90 to 95 percent rider. And I think that there should be a 125 2-stroke only class which I think PRO and the AMA already have.

If you think its 90-95% rider (which I totally agree with) then why does it matter if the 250 2 stroke races in the 450F class?

the 125 is dead people.

the 250 2 stroke still has a chance, IF you give it one.

quote:

Originally posted by Osaka #627:
the 125 is dead people.

the 250 2 stroke still has a chance, IF you give it one.

And you ride one quite well Sir Osaka! That new 450 you're sportin now is pretty siiiick though. How are you liking it now that its not -20 degrees and the fork oil isnt thick as gear oil?

well thank you!

it's good!!! i took it out to horn saturday. the valving feels relatively good out of the crate, but the springs are for a 200 lbs grown man at least. haha so pretty much it soaks the hards hits up, but other than that it's super stiff and doesn't squat.

i should have springs by next week though

the motor??? well everyone already knows the motor is killer!

Politician! I'm not a politician! I'm no stinkin politician!

No really guys here is our take on this. The 250 2-stroke is for sure faster than the 250F. So in the right hands the 250 will always beat the 250F. So what happens is those with the 250F will now need to dump 2 grand into there bike to keep it competetive and that equalizes nothing because the guys that can't afford to dump wheel barrels of money into their motor are left holding the sand bag. P.R.O is trying to keep racing as affordable and competitive as we possibly can. Case and point. We still don't force riders to buy a licence or membership. Others do! Our membership fee is the lowest and you get the most out of our series. We still have the lowest races fees of any of the local big series races.

Parker you want 250 2 strokes against your preemo 125?

quote:

Originally posted by ted:
Politician! I'm not a politician! I'm no stinkin politician!

Case and point. We still don't force riders to buy a licence or membership. Others do! Our membership fee is the lowest and you get the most out of our series. We still have the lowest races fees of any of the local big series races.

Parker you want 250 2 strokes against your preemo 125?

Uh Ted, you do in fact require a license to compete for series awards and contingencies. The other big series, SMC, does not require any license at all for series awards. yes they do require an AMA license but that's a track issue not a promoters. Last time I checked their fees were the same as yours. So you in fact are beginning to sound more and more like a politician

People, remember this is money extraction 101, sell product, sell product,sell product. The manufactures sit on the board of the A.M.A. and make the rules. The four strokes have 10 times more moving parts than a two stroke. More moving parts means more money in their pockets.

We bought into this 4-stroke rule hook, line and sinker because it was good for the enviroment, ha what a smoke screen by the manufactures (sorry the pun). They are laughing all the way to bank with all extra parts that are sold.

Look what its done for the after market product companies. The two stroke hopup really only needs a $200.00 pipe, four pipe $500.00 plus, 2 stroke piston $100.00 a four stroke piston almost $200.00 if you dont need one or two value, guides or whatever. Buyers are being addicted to these 4 strokes by the manfucturers(drug pushers).

Every race is usally $100.00 or more for two classes, enrty fee and gas. Going back to the two stroke only makes sense.

Its always about the money.

The reason we went for the 4 stroke was you could race them in 125 class. How fair was that?

Why a 4-stroke ?? Dare to be different baby! I bought my first in 99' when Yamaha had the 400. It seemed faster than the new 450's. What's even better is that I know of some that are still running well with the same valves and top end. The only flaw in those years were the shift forks. Miss a shift and it's tranny time. I've rebuilt 5 of those... Now...I buy them because everyone else does.

quote:

Originally posted by Paul 061:

quote:

Originally posted by ted:
Politician! I'm not a politician! I'm no stinkin politician!

Case and point. We still don't force riders to buy a licence or membership. Others do! Our membership fee is the lowest and you get the most out of our series. We still have the lowest races fees of any of the local big series races.

Parker you want 250 2 strokes against your preemo 125?

Uh Ted, you do in fact require a license to compete for series awards and contingencies. The other big series, SMC, does not require any license at all for series awards. yes they do require an AMA license but that's a track issue not a promoters. Last time I checked their fees were the same as yours. So you in fact are beginning to sound more and more like a politician

well paul the kids when they race pro have cheaper fees than the adults, most of the other promoters charge the same which is lame

everybody has been brainwashed with these dam 4 strokes, Just twist the grip. 2 strokes rule

This message has been edited. Last edited by: spangler146,

Reality is only about 10% of the people who ride really need to "hop up" their four stroke's engine, the 450 anyways. I think my CRF has plenty of kick, I rode/raced a 2002 CRF for 4 years, only spent money on revalving suspension and regular maintenance. I would like to see a vote, who on this board really thinks they have to buy a pipe or other engine performance mods to their 4 stroke? By the way, my 02 450 went through 3 years at Woodland and racing four years all summer on the original top end and no valve issues, no problems.

In regards to fees, everyone has them in one form or another, that is just the direction the sport has gone, you have to pay to play.

Have you heard the new KX's???

My bike needed a pipe. Maybe not for performance, but it needed one none-the-less.

quote:

Originally posted by Aaron:
Have you heard the new KX's???

My bike needed a pipe. Maybe not for performance, but it needed one none-the-less.

WHAT!!! WHAT!!! I CANT HEAR YOU MY 09 KX IS RUNNIG!!! LOL. They are sweet bikes but man they are loud with the stock pipes on them.

yea i could see that with 450's. my 07 450 is stock and it rips. when i get my 09 im leavin it stock, maybe a pipe. 250f's can always use a little help though.

quote:

Originally posted by Disturbed450:
Reality is only about 10% of the people who ride really need to "hop up" their four stroke's engine, the 450 anyways. I think my CRF has plenty of kick, I rode/raced a 2002 CRF for 4 years, only spent money on revalving suspension and regular maintenance. I would like to see a vote, who on this board really thinks they have to buy a pipe or other engine performance mods to their 4 stroke? By the way, my 02 450 went through 3 years at Woodland and racing four years all summer on the original top end and no valve issues, no problems.

In regards to fees, everyone has them in one form or another, that is just the direction the sport has gone, you have to pay to play.

I bought a Yoshi slip on for my RMZ so I could get a spark arrestor for trail riding. It did wake the motor up a bit and it was noticeable. There is also the bling factor. Oh and did I mention I got it for $175

quote:

Originally posted by Aaron:
Have you heard the new KX's???

My bike needed a pipe. Maybe not for performance, but it needed one none-the-less.

i have to say aaron kawasaki is the best one ive ever heard. that leo vince sounds great and it isnt that loud. if i bought a kawi this is what i would buy, i was impressed

Sorry Paul you loose this argument.
1) AMA licence is $39.00. About 25% more than ours.
1B) To ride the SMC Fall and Spring series you have to buy an AMA licence. You can ride the whole P.R.O. series and not buy a licence.
The SMC series is not a big series. Long but not big in the sense of rider count and amount of contingency (they don't have any) and the amount of prizes they give away. It's a great series for the clubs and not so serious racers but a much needed series.
2) P.R.O. is the only contingency series that discounts the littlest bike classes.
3) P.R.O. is the only Contingency series that discounts the riders second class. Last year P.R.O. race fees were $5 per class less that the other 2 contingency series.
P.R.O. lests the Professional riders race for TREE.

What else can we do besides ask Obama for money to give away at the races.

TREE?

quote:

Originally posted by ted:
Sorry Paul you loose this argument.
13) P.R.O. is the only Contingency series that discounts the riders second class.

Wait a minute, did I miss something? From your site and my memeory
85cc - 450cc Classes: $30.00 per class, per day

I don't think there is or ever has been a discount for the second class?

I'm not knocking the P.R.O. series, I love it and will race it. It's just that sometimes you stretch the truth a bit.

And since I have your ear, how about a family plan for gate entrance this year?