quote:

Originally posted by Paul 061:
I would bet that the reasons the (R)'s voted against it had nothing to do with the NOVA money.

Paul, that's a pretty reaching comment, can you elaborate as to what you think the (R)'s ulterior motives may be...?

Could one thing be that some (including the 2 whole D's) may believe in things like the constitution (state and like) and in the principle of going against said constitution thus robbing the very people they represent? I for one do not trust any of them but I'd like to think that sometimes they (gov) remember where they came from, from time to time...

i cant believe that fag kline is still in office WTF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

quote:

Originally posted by MX516:

quote:

Originally posted by Paul 061:
I would bet that the reasons the (R)'s voted against it had nothing to do with the NOVA money.

Paul, that's a pretty reaching comment, can you elaborate as to what you think the (R)'s ulterior motives may be...?

Could one thing be that some (including the 2 whole D's) may believe in things like the constitution (state and like) and in the principle of going against said constitution thus robbing the very people they represent? I for one do not trust any of them but I'd like to think that sometimes they (gov) remember where they came from, from time to time...

Call me a cynic, but I think it was a case of "whatever they put on the table I'm voting against" I call it the Ted Devol vote . That budget was a billion pages long, do you think they picked out one thing and said this isn't right I'm voting no?

quote:

Originally posted by Paul 061:
I would bet that the reasons the (R)'s voted against it had nothing to do with the NOVA money.

Paul....sits on the left side of the river....loads his hook with a liberal amount of republican bait....casts out....sits down and rereads the last edition of the Seattle Times.....here fishy fishy

This message has been edited. Last edited by: motodad642,

20 years ago the state of CA was stealing ORV moneys ,closing tracks , and riding areas like mad.
Now they have more riding in 1 county then WA state has .
How did they do it ? They went to court and Won the state took money against the state Constitution & other laws . The state lost big time had to payback the money + interest and penalties. no look at CA.ORV parks.
They took a truly PROGRESSIVE approach. By Progressive I mean it in literal terms (a series with a definite pattern of advance )
Not in the derogatory term, as in Progressive Liberal.

I agree with Vern here. Sending letters to politicians is great,but they are going to vote what will keep them elected,and hikers vastly outnumber dirt bikers. Taking it to court is the only way this is going to get changed.

Let's make it real simple for the Libs.

The democrat controlled House, Senate and Govenor spent way beyond their means for many years and it caught up to them. They, meaning the democrats, are now breaking state laws by stealing money from areas that the State constitution say is prohibited, in order to prop up the dwindling general fund bank account.

Let's make it even more simple. The liberal Daddy in the family of 5 is taking money that Sally earned babysitting and Johnny made mowing lawns and little Judy made selling lemonade. Daddy the liberal is raiding their piggy banks aand is buying Booze, Crack and having fun with whores because that's what he wants to do.

Let's see the letter you sent Alex.

IF AND LAWSUIT IS GOING TO BE FILED IT WOULD BE OUT OF STATE AS JURIES FROM THIS STATE WOULD NOT WANT TO PAY.
MAYBE FEDERAL COURT WOULD BE THE WAY TO GO?
LETS USE THIS FORUM AND KICK SOME IDEAS AROUND.

Ted,when did I ever say that I sent anyone a letter? I clearly said that I was not real familiar with this issue and was trying to learn more about it. Why do keep trying to pick fights with people that are on "your side" of this issue?
You need anger management.

I think we should all read this again and sign up!!!

WOHVA and the NMA are investigating our options regarding a suite now. I encourage anyone wishing to help to become a member (25 bucks) and/or donate not just money, but talent. We especially need people who are good at promoting and organizing to help get our membership and fundraising going. WOHVA is 100% volunteer and 100% of your membership fees and donations go directly to motorized recreation. Visit www.wohva.org to help or become a member. You can also contact me directly with any questions or ideas.

Aaron,

Thank you for your messages. I am very supportive of conscientious enjoyment of our environment, and appreciate the lengths to which many off road vehicle users go to ensure their access to Washington's natural areas. However, I also hope that you understand the true gravity of our economic situation. We at the legislature were being forced to make very difficult decisions, and every family in our state is feeling the pinch of this economic crisis.

In the final operating budget NOVA funds were appropriated in the Park and Recreation Commission ($9.802 million) and Recreation and Conservation Funding Board ($1.062 million) budgets to support the operation and maintenance of state parks. Generally, these funds are spent in the capital budget but because of the unprecedented $9 billion shortfall many accounts were either swept or redirected.

The NOVA funds are not 18th amendment funds - they are not gas tax dollars which are restricted by the 18th amendment. The 18th amendment refers to on-road gas tax. Off-road uses of gasoline are not subject to the tax, so it's refunded, and some portion of what's not refunded (because people don't claim it) gets used for NOVA.

Cushioning the effects of the recession for the people for Washington was our first priority this session, to be sure. We recognize the unease many are feeling about the future, and we plan to continue doing all we can to help families and communities get on the road to recovery. Please do not hesitate to contact me if you have any other comments, questions, or concerns.

Sincerely,

John McCoy
State Representative

The reply letter that Paul got almost looked real but most of the "responses" from our government officials don't look genuine to me. It looks like their assistants just pick a canned reply out of the hat that sort of meets the criteria of the complaint and then maybe edit the first sentence of the canned reply to make it more personal.

They are all a bunch of tools who don't remember what it is like to work for a living.

There is only one solution and we have to wait until the 2010 general election to make any noticeable difference. Until then I choose to save my energy for battles that I have a chance at winning.

Once we draw closer to the 2010 election then it will be time to put forth the effort to rally the troops and convince those who are just plain apathetic to our voting process to help us make a difference. Voting is one of the last real powers we have left as citizens in this country. Don't wait too long or these lifetime 10 term representatives will find a way to take away our right to vote if it helps them keep their overpaid and under-worked position.

I think the only thing we can do is vote against every current government official on the ballot regardless of political party or past job performance. Sure we will loose some who actually do their jobs well but the only way to send a clear cut no BS message to these A-holes is to effectively FIRE ALL OF THEM by voting them out.

Repeat that process every 2 years until we flush them all out and they remember who they are really supposed to work for..... that would be you and I because we are the ones paying for their inflated salaries and superior benefit packages.



-I need to ride in the worst way!

quote:

Originally posted by Aaron:
Aaron,

Thank you for your messages. I am very supportive of conscientious enjoyment of our environment, and appreciate the lengths to which many off road vehicle users go to ensure their access to Washington's natural areas. However, I also hope that you understand the true gravity of our economic situation. We at the legislature were being forced to make very difficult decisions, and every family in our state is feeling the pinch of this economic crisis.

In the final operating budget NOVA funds were appropriated in the Park and Recreation Commission ($9.802 million) and Recreation and Conservation Funding Board ($1.062 million) budgets to support the operation and maintenance of state parks. Generally, these funds are spent in the capital budget but because of the unprecedented $9 billion shortfall many accounts were either swept or redirected.

The NOVA funds are not 18th amendment funds - they are not gas tax dollars which are restricted by the 18th amendment. The 18th amendment refers to on-road gas tax. Off-road uses of gasoline are not subject to the tax, so it's refunded, and some portion of what's not refunded (because people don't claim it) gets used for NOVA.

Cushioning the effects of the recession for the people for Washington was our first priority this session, to be sure. We recognize the unease many are feeling about the future, and we plan to continue doing all we can to help families and communities get on the road to recovery. Please do not hesitate to contact me if you have any other comments, questions, or concerns.

Sincerely,

John McCoy
State Representative

hmmm seems to me we have different interpretations.

SECTION 40 HIGHWAY FUNDS. All fees collected by the State of Washington as license fees for motor vehicles and all excise taxes collected by the State of Washington on the sale, distribution or use of motor vehicle fuel and all other state revenue intended to be used for highway purposes, shall be paid into the state treasury and placed in a special fund to be used exclusively for highway purposes. Such highway purposes shall be construed to include the following:
(a) The necessary operating, engineering and legal expenses connected with the administration of public highways, county roads and city streets;
(b) The construction, reconstruction, maintenance, repair, and betterment of public highways, county roads, bridges and city streets; including the cost and expense of (1) acquisition of rights-of-way, (2) installing, maintaining and operating traffic signs and signal lights, (3) policing by the state of public highways, (4) operation of movable span bridges, (5) operation of ferries which are a part of any public highway, county road, or city street;
(c) The payment or refunding of any obligation of the State of Washington, or any political subdivision thereof, for which any of the revenues described in section 1 may have been legally pledged prior to the effective date of this act;
(d) Refunds authorized by law for taxes paid on motor vehicle fuels;
(e) The cost of collection of any revenues described in this section:
Provided, That this section shall not be construed to include revenue from general or special taxes or excises not levied primarily for highway purposes, or apply to vehicle operator's license fees or any excise tax imposed on motor vehicles or the use thereof in lieu of a property tax thereon, or fees for certificates of ownership of motor vehicles. [AMENDMENT 18, 1943 House Joint Resolution No. 4, p 938. Approved November, 1944.]

From: DNR RE Recreation E-News [mailto:RecreationENews@dnr.wa.gov]
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 6:18 PM
Subject: This Week at DNR



Hi, Folks -

A lot is going on this week with the Washington State Department of Natural Resources' (DNR) Recreation Program:

- Budget Update

- Sustainable Recreation Work Group meets Thursday

- ORV Safety Summit this Saturday (Free!)

- New emphasis on education and enforcement in Reiter Foothills

Budget Update

DNR's Recreation Program is facing some tough challenges ahead, the biggest of which is the loss of the Nonhighway and Off-Road Vehicle Activities (NOVA ) Program grants. Our yearly funding from NOVA grants has been around $1.5 million, which provides the bulk of the funding for crews to maintain recreational facilities, build and renovate facilities, and do law enforcement.

Our capital budget went from $1.05 million to $816,000. This cuts into our ability to replace failing outhouses and bridges, repair existing facilities and trails, and develop new trails and facilities.

Other budget cuts include a 60% reduction ($640,000) in General Fund appropriation and a 50% reduction in management funds ($300,000). Once the dust settles a little bit more, I plan on working with staff and user groups to figure out how we can plug the budget holes and continue to provide safe, enjoyable, and sustainable recreational opportunities.

On the positive side, we will be receiving the same amount from the ORV account ($1.5 million/year). The legislature also provided nearly $900,000 to our program to install signs in many recreation areas and carry out the recreation plans for Reiter Foothills and Ahtanum State Forest.

For more information and background about our budget, download our December 2008 newsletter (PDF): www.dnr.wa.gov//Publications/a...ews_december2008.pdf

Sustainable Recreation Work Group meets Thursday May 7

The Sustainable Recreation Work Group will be meeting from 9 a.m. to 4:30 p.m., Thursday, May 7, at Cedarbrook Conference Center in SeaTac. The work group will discuss how to sustainably fund recreation on DNR-managed lands, improve recreational access to these lands, and hear about the environmental impacts of recreation. The public will have an opportunity to comment during the meeting. The agenda is posted and more information will be available at www.dnr.wa.gov/RecreationEduca...mmaries_agendas.aspx.

Directions to Cedarbrook: www.cedarbrookcenter.com/maps_directions.php

ORV Safety Summit this Saturday at Straddleline

DNR and the Washington Off-Highway Vehicle Alliance (WOHVA) are sponsoring a FREE ORV Safety Summit from 10 a.m. to 2 p.m., on Saturday, May 9, at Straddleline ORV Park, located on State Route 8 between McCleary and Olympia. The event will feature free inspections of equipment and safety for off-road vehicles. The event is designed to give users of off-road vehicles (four-wheel, all-terrain vehicles and motorcycles ridden on trails) tips to ride safely and avoid damage to lands and natural resources. For more information, contact Larry Raedel, DNR's Chief Law Enforcement Officer, 360-902-1698 or larry.raedel@dnr.wa.gov.

New emphasis on education and enforcement in Reiter Foothills

Last Friday, May 1, DNR, state and local law enforcement, and volunteers began an intensive education and awareness campaign in the Reiter Foothills, in eastern Snohomish County. The focus of the campaign is to let people know about the problems that have been occurring in Reiter from overuse, vandalism, and unauthorized trail building.

Many of you know that Reiter Foothills is a popular place to go off-road riding. And if you've been to Reiter, you know that there's been a lot of damage to the area's natural resources, particularly the streams and other sensitive habitats. DNR and a citizens' advisory group are working on a recreation plan for the area. A draft of the plan will be available for review and comment this summer. In the meantime, DNR and its many partners had to take some immediate actions to reduce and correct some of the damage. If you'd like to know more about Reiter and even take part in a work party, contact Candace Johnson at 360-854-2803 or candace.johnson@dnr.wa.gov.



Mark Mauren

Assistant Division Manager

Asset Management and Recreation Division

Washington State Department of Natural Resources

PO Box 47014

Olympia, WA 98504-7014

360-902-1047

mark.mauren@dnr.wa.gov

http://www.atg.wa.gov/opinion....tion=archive&id=8292

If you want to read the court interpretation of Amendment 18, given to the Blue Ribbon Coalition.

By statute, activities supported by the NOVA Program must be accessed via a "Nonhighway Road" (NHR). These are roads open to the public but not constructed or maintained with gasoline tax revenues. NHRs are found in National Forests and National Parks and include such popular routes as those leading to Paradise and Sunrise in Mt. Rainier National Park, Hurricane Ridge in Olympic National Park, and Windy Ridge in the Mt. St. Helens National Volcanic Monument. Across the state, NHRs are used by recreationists to access rivers and forest lands.

SO John McCoy really dosent understand that the Article he has stated does not pertain to the funding for NOVA. I guess He might be missleading?

Now I know why I went into engineering and not law. I get 3 sentences into all this and am lost.

Lost or sleeping on your keyboard. There is a reason they clutter it up with a bunch of legal BS.